Monday, August 10, 2026

At 99, Charles J. Turner Jr. has dug up Georgia battle relics nearly his whole life. That collection and an impressive array of purchases are finding new life at the Atlanta History Center's Civil War exhibits

Charles Turner in Chattanooga, Tenn., in 1938 and in 2023 with part of his enormous collection (AHC); canister and shrapnel Turner found at Pickett's Mill decades ago and artifacts he bought on display in "More Perfect Union (Picket photos)
Charles J. Turner Jr. was just a boy when the relic hunting bug hit, and he’s been at it ever since. At age 99, Turner’s still curious about what Civil War treasure rests in the soil of North Georgia.

Turner recalls a seminal moment in 1933 or 1934, during the Great Depression, while he was growing up on Lucile Avenue in Atlanta.

“One of the kids I went to school with lived in the area and he picked up a Minie ball in the woods one day and brought it to school and he showed it to me,” the retired electrical engineer recently told the Picket.

The young hobbyist subsequently got some suggestions for places to look from noted historian and artist Wilbur G. Kurtz, who refurbished the Cyclorama painting and was a technical adviser for the film “Gone with the Wind.”

Visitors can flip through digital version of Sherman's Barnard volume at top of case (Picket photo)
Turner’s passion for digging Civil War artifacts and buying militaria is an incredible boon for the Atlanta History Center. The collector is in the process of donating hundreds of collected items to the institution. Some items he purchased in recent years went directly to the AHC.

Patrons are beginning to see the fruits of Turner’s efforts. A display in the AHC’s new “More Perfect Union” exhibit includes a trove of artifacts he bought, including a flag of the consolidated 6th and 9th Tennessee Infantry.

There’s a lot more.

Nearby is a rare cartridge box and rusted canister from the pitched fighting at Pickett’s Mill northwest of Atlanta. Farther down is a copy of photographer George Barnard’s album recording Maj. Gen. William T. Sherman’s campaign in the South and Sherman’s rank insignia (Picket photo, left). Both items belonged to the Sherman family.

Turner bought the two items from an auction house a couple years back and donated them to the AHC; he dug up the Pickett’s Mill canister in the 1950s/1960s, before the site became a state park.

His generosity will result in educational opportunities for future generations, museum officials contend. Turner's items in "More Perfect Union" are the tip of the iceberg. A gallery opening in several months figures scores of items he personally obtained while relic hunting.

His undug relics will be unveiled in coming months

Much of the relic hunter’s finds and purchases filled a large room and now the AHC is using those items to buttress its already immense collection and tell more stories about the fighting in Georgia. (Photos below, courtesy Atlanta History Center)


The gallery in “More Perfect Union” dedicated to the Atlanta Campaign has been named the Charles J. Turner Family Gallery in his honor.

His undug collection of weaponry will be the backbone of “The Hard Hand of War: Soldiers, Weapons, and Mass Production,” the museum’s second new exhibit about the Civil War. It will open in several months.

“Together, his collection represents one of the most comprehensive covering the Atlanta Campaign,” the history center says.

It’s remarkable that a man who started collecting during President Franklin Delano Roosevelt’s first term in office is still in the game. Now, Turner says, it is time for others to appreciate his collection. Most have gone to the Atlanta History Center.

“That’s where they really ought to be, where people can see them,” Turner said.

Wilbur Kurtz gave the Atlanta boy lasting advice

Turner grew up at a time when stories about the Civil War weren’t far removed from those who experienced its triumphs and tragedies. He recalls the former Confederate soldiers’ home near Grant Park.

The war was very much part of the fabric that made up Atlanta during his youth. “There were sons and daughters of veterans who had stories to tell,” Turner related to the Civil War Picket in a recent phone call.

By the time he was a teen, Turner was on the prowl for finds across the battlefields of metro Atlanta. Relic hunting in Atlanta used to be quite common, since just about the whole city was a battlefield.


Around the time he turned 18 in February 1944, Kurtz wrote a letter to his father, Charles J. Turner, with relic location suggestions and the recommendation to learn the history of the battles. (Above, courtesy Atlanta History Center)

The correspondence, which is kept at the Atlanta History Center, starts with this detailed passage:

“Your son’s hobby is an excellent one – I’d say – but perhaps I’m prejudiced, since ‘tis the same one I’ve ridden for more than years than I’d like to say. As for Civil War relics – bullets, etc., the Atlanta area affords but poor pickings at this late date. The primary shortage was brought about by the impoverished citizenry during the trying period immediately following the close of the war – they found out that bullets could be sold as junk lead to hardware stores, etc, and the money could be spent for bacon and cornmeal, next door – so bullet hunting was perhaps more profitable than blackberry gathering – being an all-year-round opportunity and not seasonable. Miss Sarah Huff (died last spring) told me that she had picked them up by the gallon, as a child – and that she knew that many, many others were doing the same things – to the same end as cited above.”

Huff as a young girl experienced the impact of the war in Atlanta and later wrote a book about her experiences.

Kurtz went on to write that Ezra Church, Cascade Road, Beecher Park, Utoy Creek area (right), Venetian Hills, New Hope Church and Kennesaw Mountain still had the potential for discoveries.

(Now, as then, diggers should seek permission from owners of private property. Most governments ban relic collecting on battlefields, parks and other historic sites. Those government sites largely were not in existence during Turner’s youth.)

Gordon Jones, senior military historian and curator at the AHC, said the Turners saw Kurtz at the July 1944 dedication of the Peachtree Creek monument at Piedmont Hospital in the Buckhead area of the city.

“Great story, great connection,” he said of their friendship.

Enthusiast struck paydirt years ago at Pickett's Mill

About that time, Charles J. Turner Jr. was drafted into the U.S. Amy and spent the closing months of World War II in Germany, where his unit oversaw labor by German prisoners of war.

He later attended Georgia Tech, where he received two engineering degrees. He had a long career with Lockheed before retiring in the mid-1980s.

The lifelong Atlantan nurtured his hobby all this time, amassing a large collection. He stayed mostly within 100 miles of Atlanta, including sites in Resaca and Jonesboro.

Notable relic collectors in the area included Beverly M. DuBose Jr. and his son Beverly M. Dubose III. Their collection was the backbone of the old AHC “Turning Point: The American Civil War” exhibit, which closed to make way for “More Perfect Union.”

Turner spent a lot of time at Pickett’s Mill in the 1950s and 1960s “Most of the stuff I found at Pickett’s started out with an old Army mine detector. I graduated up to commercial.”

He found belt buckles, bayonets, rifle barrels, rifle parts, uniform buttons and more. (Turner in the 1990s, right)

“One of the things I enjoyed finding was the shot from the cannon down that gully.”

In late May 1864, cannons mowed down Federal attackers who futilely charged through a ravine toward Confederates waiting for them in strength. At "More Perfect Union," the case of canister is next to an artillery piece that may have fired some of those rounds. (Picket photo, right; click to enlarge)

Turner says he has found thousands of items in the field. He recalls spotting a locket in a creek bed near Dallas, Ga. The locket contained an image of a woman.

The majority of the guns in his collection came from dealers and antique stores.

While in his 80s, Turner began to collect more items pertaining to the Atlanta Campaign, including the 6th/9th Tennessee flag. In the mid-2010s, he began working with the AHC to preserve his collection, officials said.

Charles J. Turner Jr. with the 6th/9th Tennessee flag before it went on display (AHC)

Gallery features a trove of Turner's collection

“More Perfect Union” tells a much wider story than “Turning Point” about the causes and repercussions of the conflict. Topics include slavery, secession, economic forces, Reconstruction and how all of this translates today.

But, of course, there are the items related to soldiers, uniforms and weaponry.

Another fabulous caption will go right here
Additional Turner items currently on display include:

-- Two canteens, including a Confederate one picked up by a Yankee soldier after the Battle of Resaca in May 1864;

--- Drum carried throughout the Atlanta Campaign by William A. McKinzie with the 78th Illinois;

-- Sword of Col. John G. Mitchell with the 113th Ohio;

-- Kepi of Confederate Brig. Gen Francis Cockrell with the Missouri Brigade. He commissioned the item for $35 from a hat maker in Mobile, Ala.; (right, Picket photo)

-- Cartridge box and cap pouch made by Wellborn, Nichols & Oliver in Dalton, Ga.

-- Smith & Wesson revolver used by a soldier with the 125th Ohio, known as “Opdycke’s Tigers”;

-- An Austrian Lorenz rifle-musket carried by William Blair Mosby of the 5th Mississippi;

-- Whitworth sharpshooter rifle used by J.E. Gilbert of the Rebel Army of Tennessee. Turner says he used to have four or five Whitworth rifles. “They are hard to find.”

-- Gen. Sherman’s order for the assault on Kennesaw Mountain;

Time has not diminished his passion for hobby

Charles Turner’s passion for collecting hasn’t much faded over the years. He was out in the field about a year ago, a close friend providing the transportation.

 “A lot of my friends are relic hunters just like me.”

The enthusiast looks for Civil War artifacts in 2012 (Courtesy AHC)
One pal drives him out to the field.

“He started hunting with me 20 years ago. I am still collecting whenever I have a chance. I am not able to get out in the field with a metal detector.”

Turner attended a AHC gala held the week “More Perfect Union” opened. He was among the special guests of honor

Wilbur Kurtz’s 1944 letter to Turner’s father was prophetic, calling the boy’s hobby “an excellent one.” (Click letter below to enlarge; courtesy Atlanta History Center)

The historian and artist finished the correspondence with encouragement for the teen to learn about the battles that shaped the destiny of the country and the South. He listed nearly a dozen books, including one by Union Maj. Gen. Jacob Cox and others by or about Joseph E. Johnston, John Bell Hood, Leonidas Polk and Patrick Cleburne.

“If that boy of yours is really serious about these things, encourage him to keep at it as a hobby to the end that he may become fully informed as to what happened – and where – during that storied summer of 1864.”

“Someone should carry the torch for this sort of thing – so why not Junior?”

Junior, who turns 100 in February, still tends to that flame.

Thursday, August 6, 2026

Gettysburg's next superintendent specializes in museums and artifacts

The next superintendent at Gettysburg National Military Park and two affiliated sites has been with the National Park Service for 37 years and has experience in museum collections.

The agency on Thursday announced Stephanie Stephens will take over the park, Eisenhower National Historic Site and Carlisle Federal Indian Boarding School National Monument in the fall. All three sites are in south-central Pennsylvania.

Stephens currently serves as the acting regional director for the Midwest region of the NPS. She will replace Kris Heister, who retired a few months ago.

 “Stephanie’s extensive experience in cultural resource stewardship, museum and curatorial leadership, collaborative planning and community engagement is perfectly suited for this position,” said acting Northeast Region Deputy Regional Director Brandon Bies. “Her curatorial knowledge is especially relevant at Gettysburg, home to the National Park Service's largest Civil War museum collection, where the preservation, care, and interpretation of these meaningful artifacts is a central mission.”

Stephens grew up in Twentynine Palms, California, where a military installation and a national park were central to her community.

Stephens has been with the National Park Service for 37 years, in a variety of leadership positions focused on the preservation and stewardship of National Park Service museum collections and cultural resources. In 2016, she was selected as the National Park Service chief curator.

The Picket asked the NPS to comment on whether Stephens has any near-term objectives but has not yet received a response.

Saturday, August 1, 2026

Gen. Jacob Cox slept here: Citizen-soldier's division camped on land that became Emory University. His competence and memoirs are lauded, his racial views are not

Jacob Cox (Library of Congress), marker on Clifton Road and walkway nearby on Emory University (Picket photos)
In 1944, Wilbur G. Kurtz – restorer of the Battle of Atlanta Cyclorama, rescuer of the locomotive Texas and technical adviser to the film “Gone With the Wind” – wrote a letter to the father of an Atlanta teenager whose hobby was relic collecting.

Kurtz provided some suggestions on places to dig, but ended the correspondence with books the boy should read to really understand what happened in the city in summer 1864.

At the top of the list, in the letter kept by the Atlanta History Center, was “Atlanta,” one of several notable Civil War books authored by Maj. Gen Jacob D. Cox.

The man who went on to become Ohio governor, U.S. interior secretary, congressman and president of the University of Cincinnati was among the most successful citizen-soldiers of the conflict. He served in both theaters of the Civil War, including the Atlanta Campaign.

“I think Cox did fine during the Atlanta Campaign, and his advance southward on 27 June (Battle of Kennesaw Mountain) provided ‘the only advantage of the day,' according to Sherman,” says Charlie Crawford, president emeritus of the Georgia Battlefields Association.

Crawford said he believes Cox’s 1882 account (Ebay photo) of the Atlanta Campaign is largely accurate and “provides some insights that other memoirs lack, whereas his account of the Second Manassas Campaign is tainted by his animus toward Fitz John Porter.

Civil War historian Robert D. Jenkins, executive director of the Blue and Gray Education Society, said Cox’s book about Atlanta “is fair and good, and for a long, long time was really one of the only reliable histories of the Atlanta Campaign until the middle and end of the 20th century."

I reached out to Crawford and Jenkins on Saturday after stopping to photograph a sign on the Emory University campus near Decatur. Cox’s Third Division of Schofield’s XXXIII Corps camped there on the evening of July 19, 1864, a few days before the Battle of Atlanta and fighting in Decatur.

While I had heard of Cox, particularly his strong performance as a brigadier general at Utoy Creek in August 1864, I didn’t know much about his career.

Cox was a trial lawyer before the Civil War and had to scramble to learn military skills West Pointers already possessed. He fought at Antietam and South Mountain and later moved to the Western Theater.

“In early 1864, Cox marched with Sherman to Atlanta as second in command of the Army of the Ohio. He performed yeoman service during this period. In July, he led a flank attack which caused the Confederate Army of Tennessee to retreat from its strong position on Kennesaw Mountain,” according to an article by Gene Schmiel in “On Point,” a publication of the Army Historical Foundation.

“Cox’s forces were the first to cross the Chattahoochee River, forcing the Confederates into the defenses of Atlanta. Later that month, Cox’s division cut the final supply line into Atlanta, forcing General Hood to abandon Atlanta and opening the way for Union control.”

Cox later played a crucial role in crushing Hood’s Confederate forces at Franklin, Tenn. Crawford points out some critics claim the general took too much credit for some victories.

Nothing in his background indicated Cox (left, after the war) would be a successful military man.

“I have become used to being surprised as to my own fate, and take it rather quietly, feeling a kind of third person’s curiosity at looking on to see what is to become of me,” Cox wrote in 1866.

One aspect of Cox’s service to the country has not aged well.

While his family had abolitionist ties and he was anti-slavery, Cox opposed moves toward racial equality after the war.

“Some of his post-war comments about what to do with 3.5 million former slaves put him on the wrong side of current thinking,” says Crawford. The politician had advocated for a separate colony or territory for blacks.

Cox died in 1900 at age 71.


As for that historical marker, I asked Crawford what happened in the area during fighting for Atlanta. (Emory University as we know it did not exist in 1864; its forerunner, Emory College, was established in Oxford, Ga.)

On July 21, 1864, Cox's division transited west from north of Decatur along what is now N. Decatur Road (known as Paces Ferry Road at the time) to a position north of the Augustus Hurt house. (Above, Crawford map of Cox division leaving the Emory area)

Stanley's division was almost simultaneously marching southward along what is now Briarcliff Road and passing just west of what is now the campus (right, Picket photo).

During the July 22 fighting in Decatur, a 17th Corps wagon train escorted by 43rd Ohio Infantry and part of the 9th Illinois Mounted Infantry was heading south toward Decatur along what is now Clairmont Road, says Crawford.

“Hearing the sound of the fighting and also being warned by couriers and 15th Corps wagon drivers who (Brig. Gen. John) Sprague had instructed to flee northward, the lead 17th Corps wagons turned west on North Decatur Road and passed along the south edge of the campus,” says Crawford.

“Wagons that were farther behind (17th Corps train being about four miles long) turned west on other roads.” 

As I prepared this blog post, I reviewed my 2011 article on the little-known Aug. 5-7, 1864, engagement at Utoy Creek. (Below, Picket photo of Federal trenches)

Coincidentally, I had mentioned both Kurtz and Cox in that post.

In 1932, Kurtz wrote about an Atlanta family that hid in a bombproof, or "dugout," during the fighting there. Up to 26 people huddled inside at the height of the fighting in western Atlanta.

Gen. Cox on Aug. 11, 1864, wrote this compelling passage.

“In this bomb-proof four families are now living, and I never felt more pity than when, day before yesterday, I looked down into the pit, and saw there, in the gloom made visible by a candle burning while it was broad day above, women sitting on the floor of loose boards, resting against each other, haggard and wan, trying to sleep away the days of terror, while innocent-looking children, four or five years old, clustered around the air-hole, looking up with pale faces and great staring eyes as they heard the singing of the bullets that were flying thick above their sheltering place.”

Friday, July 31, 2026

A flier checked a bag carrying five pieces of Civil War artillery ammo. She didn't know they had been stolen by a grandchild from Fort Morgan on Mobile Bay, officials say

The artillery rounds were wrapped in paper towels (TSA-Gulf Shores photos)
Alabama’s Fort Morgan State Historic Site will not press charges after a juvenile took artillery ammunition from the coastal Civil War fort and the artifacts were detected by the Transportation Security Administration in the checked bag of the child's unwitting grandmother.

The TSA recently posted an article about the July 18 incident at Gulf Shores International Airport. It said screener Justin Dupree spotted the five iron balls, at first thinking they appeared to be a medicine ball wrapped in paper towels. 

The article called the items cannonballs, though observers said most are likely canister or grapeshot  The largest was described as being about the size of a grapefruit.

“I had never seen anything quite this unique,” said Dupree, a TSA officer for four years. “I’ve seen inert grenades and training munitions but never an Indiana Jones-esque stolen artifact-type situation.” He was concerned they might have been live.

The TSA contacted local authorities, who determined the prohibited rounds were inert and did not contain explosive components.

TSA officer Justin Dupree in the checked baggage area of the airport (TSA)
Capt. Nathan Lusk of the Baldwin County Sheriff’s Office told the Picket in an email that the items were taken by the juvenile from a storage area at the fort.

“Fort Morgan personnel were able to confirm the items as their property due to paint markings they apply to artifacts. The grandmother stated that she did not know they were stolen. Fort Morgan’s director chose to not press charges, so there was no further action from us.”

The pieces were returned to the state park. Heather Tassin, the site manager, said, “Due to this being an active investigation we are unable to provide any comments.”

The airport is about 20 miles east of Fort Morgan, which sits at the mouth of Mobile Bay.

Fort Morgan is nestled in a popular vacation area (Picket photo)
The historic site played a prominent part in the 1864 Battle of Mobile Bay.

Mobile was one of the last major Confederate ports still open at the time. Fort Morgan, with a garrison of about 600, and other fortifications meant to keep Union Adm. David Farragut out. The bay was heavily mined with what were then called torpedoes.

On Aug. 5, 1864, the monitor USS Tecumseh struck a mine within a few hundred yards of the fort. More than 90 hands died when the monitor rolled over and sank. The other 17 Union vessels began to move back, but Farragut, on board the USS Hartford, demanded the fleet move through, uttering “Damn the Torpedoes!”

Farragut triumphed over the opposition of heavy batteries in Fort Morgan and Fort Gaines. His fleet secured the surrender of the ironclad CSS Tennessee and defeated the squadron of Confederate Adm. Franklin Buchanan.

The USS Tecumseh buoy off Fort Morgan; Dauphin Island is in background (Picket photo)
Farragut’s brazen assault was one half of a Union operation. Troops landed on Dauphin Island and laid siege to Fort Gaines, which had few ships to help in its defense. Confederate Col. Charles D. Anderson had half his infantry foe’s number and surrendered

After the fall of Fort Gaines on Aug. 8, Yankee troops moved on Fort Morgan across the bay, forcing its surrender on Aug. 23.

Mobile itself was heavily fortified and the Union command moved on after securing the bay. The city surrendered in April 1865, three days after Appomattox.

Thursday, July 30, 2026

Battle of the Crater: Park historian Emmanuel Dabney thinks you should know about these 5 men, three of whom fought with the USCT and two who wore gray

John Elder's painting of the Crater emphasizes the Confederate perspective 
The Battle of the Crater, which occurred 162 years ago today, wasn’t just a significant defeat for Union forces trying to break Confederate siege lines at Petersburg, Va. The debacle is remembered as much for the massacre of scores of U.S. Colored Troops who were surrendering.

Federal soldiers set off a mine on July 30, 1864, under a position held by South Carolinians. Troops rushed into the giant breach but became targets when they massed in an area with little room to maneuver. 

Among them were USCT units who had been encouraged by their white officers to use "Fort Pillow! No Quarter!" as their battle cry. Instead, they received “no quarter” from Rebels.

Petersburg National Battlefield this summer offers daily ranger programming that includes an 11 a.m. tour of the Crater.

I asked Emmanuel Dabney (right), chief of resource management at the park, to name a few soldiers whose actions or memories stand out from fighting at the Crater. He mentioned these five men:

Pvt. Peter Churchwell, 23rd USCT

Churchwell had the unfortunate distinction of being returned to slavery after his capture at the Crater. He had escaped from Orange County, Va., in 1862. He worked in Washington, D.C., before he enlisted in the 23rd US Colored Troops.

After his capture at the Crater, Churchwell was put to work for several days burying the dead before he was sent to Danville, Va., according to the National Park Service. (At left, USCT soldier in action, Library of Congress)

Churchwell testified later in his life, “I was kept there until Major Reuben Gordon, my old Master, heard I was in prison, and he came there and claimed me as his slave [and] sold me to a Mr. Shedrick Lee, a slave dealer at Richmond, Va., and he sold me to Luke Powell a slave dealer who took me to Wilmington N.C. [and] I was there 8 days working in a shoe shop of Geo. French’s store, [and] then sold to Patrick Murphy who took me on his farm near Raleigh N.C., and worked at making boot [and] shoes for him, [and] he sold them.”

Churchwell escaped in early 1865 and fled to Wilmington, N.C., which had fallen to the Union troops. He lived in Washington, D.C., in his later years, according to the park.

Capt. Robert K. Beecham, 23rd USCT

Like many other officers, Beecham served in white units early in the Civil War before they were assigned to lead USCT regiments.

Dabney describes the officer’s 1902 memoirs, “As If It Were Glory: Robert Beecham's Civil War from the Iron Brigade to the Black Regiments,” as “amazing.” (Photo, courtesy Wisconsin Historical Society, Unique ID W0139K4

Beecham was captured at Gettysburg and then exchanged before joining the 23rd USCT. He was wounded and captured at the Crater and served eight months in captivity before he escaped and found his way to freedom just before war’s end.

The soldier wrote in this recollections: “The Afro-American came forward cheerfully and volunteered his strength, his brawn, his heart’s blood to save the honor of the flag that to him and his race had been the symbol of every dishonor.”

Pvt. Abraham Tuckson, 23rd USCT

Abraham Tuckson, who escaped from slavery in Virginia in 1862, was killed at the Crater. His remains were never identified, said Dabney. Hester Tuckson, his widow and mother of their children, was left to remember her departed husband.

In 2011, Eric Mink with the NPS wrote about the couple, who were enslaved in Spotsylvania County.

Abraham, after he fled from enslaver Dr. John R. Taylor, returned to the plantation to retrieve what he felt was rightfully his, including clothing.

“Abraham’s confrontation with Dr. Taylor is an example of a former slave embracing his freedom and sense of independence,” Mink wrote. ”We also learn about a woman whose husband left to fight to maintain his freedom and secure hers, but she remained on the plantation and managed to keep the rest of her family together.

 

Col. John Cheves Haskell, Confederate artillery battalion

Dabney said the officer commanded an artillery battalion and has a vivid account of stopping at least some of the massacre of surrendered USCTs at the Crater. (Photo: Library of Congress)

Haskell and several other Confederate officers tried to stem the slaughter, but they had little success.

“Our men, who were always made wild by having negroes sent against them … were utterly frenzied with rage. Nothing in the war could have exceeded the horrors that followed. No quarter was given, and for what seemed a long time, fearful butchery was carried on,” Haskell wrote years later in his memoirs.

William A. Day, 49th North Carolina Infantry

Like Col. Haskell, Day recalled the fury Confederate defenders heaped on the USCT troops, Dabney says. The Black soldiers brought their own anger into the battle, seeking retribution for the massacre at Fort Pillow of African-American troops.

“(Confederates) dashed up to the brink of the ditch, halted a moment as if mapping out their work, fired a rolling volley into the ditch filled with Yankees, the most of them being negroes, at this feet; then turning the butts of their guns, they sprang into the ditch among them,” Day wrote in “Confederate Veteran” magazine.

“The slaughter was terrible. The soldiers were excited, they were reckless; they burst the negroes’ skulls with the butts of their guns like eggshells. The officers tried to prevent it, but they were powerless. It was ‘No quarter for the Rebels’ that morning, and it is no quarter for them now. The fight was soon ended.”